Riots in England. 6-10 August 2011

Riots in England. 6-10 August 2011



Politics UK

‎26 years old man from Croydon has Died after being shot last night.

Source-BBC

T.H.

can't find anything on it.....

Richard Frazer

So now we start to hear of the deaths inflicted in memory or the death of someone (who may or may not have been in possession of a loaded gun)

Jac.H.

How many more to come? Unfortunately even this will not stop the mindless rioting.

T.S.

Circumstances unknown, also unknown if it's anything to do with the riots, also unknown if he was shot by rioters, gangs or Police!

S.D.N.

shot by the police i expect. it's what they do best, apart from accepting envelopes of cash from journalists.

A.P.

If he'd been shot by police, we'd know about it.

Politics UK ‎>http://www.thisiscroydontoday.co.uk/Exclusive-Man-shot-dead-West-Croydon/story-11366027-detail/story.html<

Richard Frazer

Doesn't really matter who shot the guy. It's another death to be attributed in honour of a death. Seems a little like perpetual motion

C.S.

yes S.D.N. are you out rioting or just on a pc agitating others ,your comments are out of order

Alan J B Wyllie

Without defending S.D.N.. Some coppers really are ar$eholes.

I once found a puppy, took it home fed it and wash it. The next day I handed it into the police staion..and I was charged with theft of the dog(as I had kept it overnight) and breach of peace(as I said"you are having a F****ng laugh).

F.S.

S.D.N. - What on earth draws you to that conclusion. These types of comments just make matters worse.

C.S.

loads of them are alan but in light of whats happening down south S.D.N. s comments are dangerous and illinformed

R.H.

tbh the police are mostly revenue collectors from motorists and protection for the elite. it seems very little police time is spent on gang crime or solving civilian crime. still i certainly support the police in fighting this uprising of anarachy.

A.P.

The met has a whole unit dedicated to gang crime. I agree they can be a little lazy and apathetic from time to time. We had a neighbour with a caravan that we saw somebody hooking up to their car to tow away while they were out. We called the police who told us they wouldn't do anything until it had gone. The caravan was never seen again.

Then there was the time my Marshall and guitar kit (not the guitar thankfully) was stolen out of my boot when I was getting ready to go out. They also tried to get the radio, couldn't remove it, so they just smashed it.

Only reason I got those back was because I went round all of the second hand/cash generator shops in the city asking them to look out for them. I got them back as a result and they managed to convict the fence, who got a slap on the wrist, and the perpetrators were never found. Did keep the tag they put on the Marshall at the police station on there though. Quite cool having a Marshall with a 'police evidence' tag on it. :-)

But overall, saying that they're only interested in protecting the rich is pretty unfair. There are a lot of good coppers out there doing the job for the right reasons.

L.McS.

I Feel that the reason it has all got out of control is people are jumping on the band wagon, you know ok that young lad did get killed and his family and freinds will want answers but then, there are people who will join in and get carried away this then has a domino effect and as a lot of young people are unemployed and arent at school they have time on there hands with nothing to do.

Politics UK

Riot-scarred Tottenham began picking up the pieces today from a night of violence that local trade unionists warned could erupt anywhere in Britain due to unemployment and social alienation write the Morning Star.

Is the Morning Star correct when it says that the riots in Tottenham is a sympton(sic) of Tory Britain"?

Tottenham unrest a sympton of Tory Britain / Britain / Home - Morning Star

www.morningstaronline.co.uk

British national daily newspaper, widely acknowledged as the only English-language socialist daily in the world.

W.H.
Communists blame anything right of centre when these things arise. They would have said the same thing under new labour.

J.F.

I'd say its a symptom of multicultural Britain. Thousands of extra unskilled workers into the UK population every year while there are not enough jobs for existing Britains.

S.D.N.

damn right. Bristol St. Pauls; Liverpool Toxteth; Manchester Moss-side; Oldham; Bradford; Sheffield; Barnsley; Burnley; Blackburn; Birmingham; Nottingham; Sheffield; Newcastle; Glasgow; Leicester..........

C.S.

J.F.it has nothing to do with multiculturism

J.F.

When I say multiculturism, I meant mass immigration.

There are simply no jobs and importing anyone, especially unskilled workers, will simply increase the line at the dole office and put a strain on all services.

C.S.

and S.D.N. when was the last time there was a riot in glasgow

C.S.
please enlighten me

S.F.

I agree with the Morning Star!

C.S.

its to do with lack of hope and the tory cuts are hitting these areas harder than others people are scared and feel badly let down

A.W.

After a night of true horror it's sickening to see any political party / paper try to use this to there advantage.

S.F.

It's so obvious!

C.S.

and with the lack of trust in the police it doesnt help when they kill locals and cosh 16yr old girls not conducive to good relations

C.S.

andy the papers are all going to use it ,its how they sell papers

J.F.

Race has nothing to do with immigration, which is an economic policy.

Thats not to say these cuts havent been too deep and in all the wrong places, which they have, but the UK government is not creating enough jobs to meet demands.

G.C.

What a load of old left wing garbage

C.S.

and immigration had nothing to do with the riot end off

C.S.

so you dont feel these youths seeing all the money getting thrown at the olyimpics and funding for their youth clubs slashed has had an effect then

G.C.

Nope none what so ever any excuses to burn Tottenham and try and set fire to police officers is gladly excepted down there ...which is why I am glad I ain't there any more

It was a grand night out for looting and that's it

C.S.

wonder if our pm thinks its important enough to cut short his well earned break [poor thing hasnt had a holiday for a month]

G.C.

Cecilla shooting locals ??... you missed out the words gun touting. hair triggered criminal

A.L.

there will be many more riots in the next few years

C.S.

it has not been established if he was carrying a gun that is speculation .that triustworthy open honest body the IPCC is looking into it

A.L.

was he a brazilian newsvendor?

G.C.

So who shot the policeman ? Himself

C.S.

well we shall see wont we if he had shot the policeman this would have been all over the news when it happened .not attempted to be pushed under the carpet

C.S.

im sure the headline would have went somthing like this [aman was today shot and killed after opening fire on police ]he lack of this info is imo suspect

I.J.

.... The day I listen to anything the Morning Star says will be a very sad day indeed!

G.C.

Officers stopped the car in Ferry Lane, Tottenham, on Thursday to carry out an arrest when the 29-year-old man, named locally as Mark Duggan, was shot.

Three shots were fired. A bullet was found lodged in a police radio.

S.F.

As it happens I agree with this article and I'd never heard of this newspaper before, so I had no prejudice!

G.C.‎

"Shots were fired and a 29-year-old man, who was a passenger in the cab, died at the scene.

"The attempted arrest was part of a pre-planned operation under Trident.

"It is believed that two shots were fired by a firearms officer, equippe...

See more

K.F.‎

"Initial tests show bullet lodged in radio during Duggan shooting was police issue"

G.C.

S.F.it is a paper Stalin would have been proud to have Published so expected the Tory bashing from this commie rag

C.S.

well well now that is a surprise not

C.S.

so G.C.what do you say to kenneths post

C.S.

where did you here this kenneth

K.F.

Its an interesting conundrum the police find themselves in. They are asked to police poor, working class areas with middle class laws for the middle aged property owners of the UK . You then find a generation criminalised and resenting the police .

Some communities across the UK have been at war with the police for generations and a riot like last nights , is only a misunderstanding away . When people like Benjamin Zephaniah have little trust in the police you can understand how many feel victimised .

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2006/aug/05/comment.race?CMP=twt_gu

S.F.

To be fair, if anything like that had happened under Gordon Brown's leadership, I can't imagine what the Murdoch empire, the Daily Mail and the Telegraph would have made of it

A guess: labour bashing??

Obviously it is a symptom that needs analysis and it shows how edgy things are in the UK for large parts of the population!

S.F.

Kenneth, your link has really moved me! Scarry

G.C.

So be it and if true they need to learn how to aim better but I guess they will get away with it as it was lucky they had that spare gun to put on the floor of the taxi eh ?

So where is the initial result published ?

C.S.

ask kenneth

K.L.M.

http:// www.foreignersinuk.co.uk/news-foreign_workers_wanted_for_olympic_jobs_423.html

Maybe it had something to do with this???

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-olympics/article-23915847-half-of-olympic-village-workers-come-from-abroad.do

Or this ^?

A.P.

Yes, we often get this sort of violence under a Tory government, since a significant proportion of left-wingers are uneducated thugs.

K.L.M.

So, sorry but I agree with Jordan.

S.F.

You are incredibly funny tonight A.P.!

A.P.

Thank you So Fi. :-)

S.F.

Welcome, it always feels good to please a right winger... never know ... he might be your boss one day!lol

S.F.

Are you mad?!

D.L.‎.

What we need to think about is why people think its ok to act like this and deal with that not out thug them John.

K.L.M.

I've just seen somebody say thay have a 9pm curfew in place

D.L.

really?

Richard Frazer

Some of the Birmingham Shops had the police contact them to say 'if they call evacuate' - How scarey is that

D.L.

god my nerves cant take this .........my son is in the middle of london

K.L.M.

Oh no, Dawn, I hope he is safe!!

D.L.

he is at the mo

K.L.M.

He should get outta there until this all gets under control :(

S.F.

I can't, I have mixed feelings, on the one hand I am shocked and sad at this destruction, on the other hand I blame the elite of society for what's happening not the poor souls who are destroying society along with their own lifes. These riots are why we need a fairer society or it will only get worse.

K.L.M.

Imho, I really don't think there is a reason behind these vile yobs' mindless acts of violence, arson and theft. There is no back story or a reaction to unemployment because most of these creatures are career dole dossers, waiting for their next hand out.

S.F.‎

"most of these creatures are career dole dossers, waiting for their next hand out"

And as common 'wisdom' will tell us, they do seem extremely happy to be so ... ... They really act like happy people!

A.P.

Of course it never has anything at all to do with Tory policies,funny how these things always seem to happen on their watch though

I.J.

S.F.I think its fair to say opinions on this issue are very polarised. Camp A believes society has some responsibility for the actions of the rioters. Camp B believes the rioters are criminal low lifes who will get what they deserve. I'm with Camp B

K.L.M.

ME camp B too.

S.F.

Ian I also believe they should face the consequences of their actions (when my kids fuck up I try to understand why to adjust their circumstances and my behavior AND I sanction) along with making sure we live in a society that gives them decent and interesting outlets for their adrenaline!

I.J.

Andy ...... priceless ...... its all the Tories fault ...... I wonder who'd been burning those shops and houses down, throwing things at the police, mugging members of the public .....it was the Tories all along. Personally I blame it on massed gangs of young Conservatives (the b****rds) .... lol

Richard Frazer

Andy - It was the collapse of our economy on the previous watch though wasn't it

Richard Frazer

Camp B - Camp A may have a point but would let the country rot to prove their point

I.J.

Richard stop it ..... Nu Labour did absolutely nothing wrong in 17 years its much more reasonable to blame it on 15 months of Tory rule (despite the fact that Labours cuts would have been almost as bad) ....

Richard Frazer

Wait a second; are you saying that this would of been inevitable as the same circumstances would of played out, as we are only in the beginnings of a Conservative rule anyway?

A.P.

Well who is cutting budgets so Youth centres have to close,leaving kids on street corners with nothing to do,who took away EMA so most of these kids probably wont bother staying on at school anymore to try and get on and do better in life,t...See more

K.L.M.

I can't believe what I'm reading, lol

H.A.

Don't get too heated. I did earlier on. This is very extreme guys and although we don't agree with each other, we do get on well enough to exchange views. This is an enormous situation and everyone is guilty and everyone is innocent.

H.A.

The left can be blamed. The right can be blamed. Racism can be blamed. The benefits culture can be blamed. Everything is playing a part in this.

Richard Frazer

Im not getting embroiled in the arguements with sympathies of the violent criminals either

A.P.‎

1981 was only about 18 months onto Tory rule,thats all it takes

Richard Frazer

It does amaze me though - How Labour's hard line left wingers will drag the country to ruin to show the country will go to ruin. However this situation is not political this time. . . it is criminal and nothing like the 80's riots as they actually had a point

I.J.

Andy its all very well getting all Class Warrior but saying that you probably hate the Tories more than the rioters is frankly purile. I don't like the Tories or Labour but am pragmatic enough to know that Labour would have implemented 95%+ of the cuts the Tories have. This issue though has nothing to do with which Party you support but everything to do with opposing criminality.

S.F.

Richard don't you think they actually make a point?

I think they do. They screamed 'you're rich we're not; tonight we're rich'.

It's about the haves and the haves-not, about the terrible income gap...About this rampant materialism and this constant competition...

It's also about a ruling elite so out of touch, lacking the most basic empathy towards people who have suffered through the cuts and the recession... Anger has been piling up for so long...

Richard Frazer

It may well be, but not is not the time to understand their woes in life. Now is the time to seek justice for the people who live in these cities and are being terrorised.

H.A.

Guys do you think that these rioters ASKED PEOPLE THEIR POLITICAL PERSUASION before they robbed them, burnt their houses, destroyed their vehicles? By all means you are entitled to reason, engage in debate - but the reality away from the co...See more

Richard Frazer

I have sympathy and empathy for the people whos businesses have been burnt out, the person who got shot (if he was innocent) and the people who are scared for their lives in their homes

H.A.

Put your political differences to one side. Just for once. And join in humanity and outrage at our country being destroyed.

H.A.

Okay I'll shut up now. Sorry but I feel a bit passionately about this, as I'm sure a lot of others do.

I.J.

S.F.I just don't agree. Its not to with rich versus poor, black versus white or Right versus Left ..... It is however responsible citizens versus criminals ....... Good luck to the Met and all the police forces around the country tonight.

S.F.

Ian, the real question is how do we make a criminal then. Do you really think babies are born criminals and by chance these evil babies tend to be born and deprived areas?

Richard Frazer

Support the police effort to protect innocent. Appose the criminality and violence

Richard Frazer

Nurture or nature question. So-Fi is this really the right thread for that?

A.P.

As I say,dont agree with the rioting and plundering,just dont know what other way frustrated people have to get their point across,the government dont listen,most of these cuts are ideologically driven,Tories doing what Tories do,300 Billio...See more

S.F.‎

"Nurture or nature question. So-Fi is this really the right thread for that?"

Actually yes, it's the right question for tonight!

S.F.

Or why do you think Britain suddenly has thousands of criminals??

Richard Frazer

Actually thinking about it Sophie you're probably right. I will start a new thread on this

S.F.

I suffered greatly through the recession and have been feeling very angry at the bad way the elite dealt with it, so I know I could have been on the bad side with the bad guys ... if I had not been a boring middle-class girl...

I.J.

S.F.it depends on your perspective ..... your coming at it I presume from the angle that society has turned these people into criminals. I disagree. I believe its a case of too many people not being aware of their responsibilities.

A.P.

Well need to build more prisons then to house them all,stop making cuts in police ,fire brigade and the prison service,we are obviously going to need these people more than ever

L.J.

so who is responsible for making them aware of their responsibilities Ian ? And does tory condemnation achieve this goal ?

H.A.

I'm sorry to hear that So Fi. I don't always agree with your views but its miserable to feel life is a daily grind, never being able to pay the bills, with that feeling of not being in control of whats going on. I knew people in the 90s who...See more

H.A.

I think your comment on thousand criminals is a very valid title for a different discussion thread.

S.F.

Thanks Ian

I.J.

Lisa we could have an entire thread on that topic. I'm sure where your coming from regarding Tory condemnation as I don't accept its party politically motivated? With regard to learning responsibility I suppose ultimately its a parental issue but again far too many carp upon about rights but seem unable or unwilling to accept the personal rersponsibility that with rights .....

H.A.

I should be entitled to feel safe in the country I live in. Everyone should.

K.L.M

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2023902/London-riots-Left-wing-cynics-blame-Tory-cuts-mayhem.html#socialLinks
Are you getting this all you lefties! lol

London riots: Left-wing cynics blame the Tory cuts for mayhem

www.dailymail.co.uk

Left-wing politicians have cynically sought to make political capital out of the riots, blaming government cuts for the orgy of violence.

S.F.

Well I still think it's fairly obvious that these riots happen within a wider context, even the New York Times mentions that!

>http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/09/world/europe/09britain.html?ref=world<

Budget Cuts and Scorn for Police Seen Fueling London Riot

www.nytimes.com

The riot was the latest in what has turned out to be a season of unrest in Britain, with multiple demonstrations escalating into violence in recent months.

S.F.

‎‎‎"There was some speculation that the latest outbreak partly reflected the painful austerity cuts in Britain’s national budget that have shriveled programs for unemployed urban youth."

Frustration in the impoverished area, as in many others in Britain, has mounted as the government’s austerity budget has forced deep cuts in social services. At the same time, a widely held disdain for law enforcement here, where a large Afro-Caribbean population has felt singled out by the police for abuse, has only intensified through the drumbeat of scandal that has racked Scotland Yard in recent weeks and led to the resignation of the force’s two top commanders.""

American media saying, not me

K.L.M.

Yes, but violence is not the answer.......they need this fantastic page (Politics UK) to make their voices heard..

J.R.

Well, it seems the 'left wing politician' (who only exist in the minds of Daily Mail readers!) have hit the nail squarely on it's head...

R.F.

People don't just randomly start rioting. This is symptomatic of some deep-seated social problems (which did exist before the coalition government, but have obviously been exacerbated by their policies).

K.L.M.

Yes, but the majority of whom I see on the news are afro-carribean....it seems like that's all who live in these areas. So of course it will seem like the police are 'picking' on them when it's predominantly afro carribs

P.L.

if there was a left wing govt in power the right wing would blame their softy bleeding heart approach to law and order. when we have a right wing govt the left blames them for causing disenfranchisement, social exclusion etc etc. you can trust both sides to play party politics whilst the people who pay their govt wages have their business burned.

I blame the rioters by the way.

K.L.M.

Hear hear, Patrick!

K.L.M.

There are young, oppressed youth in my area, who don't have jobs, yet they're not out rioting.

Richard Frazer

Best Statement of the day Patch

K.L.M.

Wait for BNP to jump on the bandwagon, lol, it'll be "we told you so" lmao.

S.F.

Yes the far-right is rising along with the riots! very worrying

Richard Frazer

These rioters are scavengers Robin - and you are right these riots have not just happened, they are organised to take advanatage of areas of the country while the police try and protect London.

K.L.M.

Yes, but these mindless thugs are playing right into the right's hands :(

Alan J B Wyllie

Im follow Nick Griifen on twitter and you can tell how happy he is....Twat

K.L.M.

The thing is, these type don't really do politics, do they, regretfully.

K.L.M.

Is NG on facebook? Lol, I might have a look and follow him on that ;)

Alan J B Wyllie

From our friend Nick

"nickgriffinmep Nick Griffin MEP

Local English activists keeping out of way. So must all of ours, let the colonists cause all the trouble."

Richard Frazer

http://www.smh.com.au/world/big-game-turns-confronting-and-ugly-20110809-1ijqj.html?from=smh_sb

Big game turns confronting and ugly

www.smh.com.au

K.L.M.

I can see that movie 'V' for Vendetta being played out very soon, very worrying indeed :(

Alan J B Wyllie

Twitter Karen,

>http://twitter.com/#!/nickgriffinmep<

Warning: Will make you feel "unclean"

K.L.M.

Speaks volumes, Richard : /

K.L.M.

Why thank you, Alan, lol :)

K.L.M.

bummer...the flippin page won't load :( gutted, lol

K.L.M.

‎'Liked' his FB page, lol, it says "Going off in bethnal green as muslims beat back black attack on islamic bank. Looting at mile end."

A.P.

Sadly predictable though,same conditions as 1981, a Tory government in all but name,pursuing a Right wing agenda which makes a large section of society feel disenfranchised,no jobs,no Youth clubs closed down due to cuts,people with nowhere to go and nothing to do.. all we need is the Argies to invade and everything has gone full circle,son of Thatcher will finally be able to emulate his heroine

A.L.

the whole world has gone mad, and the mob is currently ruling, but by tomorrow the hysteria brigade will be on the attack. i don't do excuses, but we have to look at the reasons behind this mess if it is to be avoided in the future. saddly we have very few people in authority that can be respected or looked on as an example to society. don't feel very hopeful tonight.

S.F.

This is the real teaching of that sad story: you need an impecable leadership if you want to lead a country through tough times. There is a complete lack of true leadership in the UK at the moment.

S.F.

And by that I do not mean send the army. I mean don't fiddle expenses, don't lie, don't be so smug, don't attack the poorest, make the rich pay and not just the poor...

A.L.

saddly our political system is rotten to the core, and we criticise third world countries

C.S.

we are celts we know the truth

A.L.

we are in a position to set up a more open system C.S., indeed it is our duty to do so.

R.F.

The right's individualistic arguments won't stack up. Can't simply blame the bad guys themselves when it's clear that society is producing them en masse. I think the government and their acolytes will be forced to take a lesson from all this.

S.F.

Hope you will! I notice only England is on fire! Speaks volumes!

A.L.

think it could happen anywhere so fi, would not be surprised if paris goes up next.

S.F.‎

"I think the government and their acolytes will be forced to take a lesson from all this."

Hopefully the blinkers will finally fall off. When I think only a few days ago arrogant Hague was saying that the UK was a 'safe heaven'... ...

S.F.

Why Paris?

A.L.

i'm off to my bed, nos da good night, hope everyone has a safe night.

S.F.

I meant only England within a UK context ie not in Wales or Scotland.

A.L.

paris has a history of riots, and historically these things happen at same time over the continent of europe

F.A.

Paris does have a large population that is impoverished. it's happened before, albeit not on this Scale

A.L.

it could happen in swansea so fi, politics is not as exiting in wales as in scotland, there is a chance of change in scotland, and hope

A.L.

nos da, good night all, be kind to each other.

S.F.

Paris does not have a history of riots anymore than London young man! that is sheer prejudice!

S.F.

That is insane british anti-French propaganda, me thinking these events would teach humility to Brits! sight...

But you never know...

M.W.

lol @ people trying to make this into some sort of political point. What I witnessed was just a bunch of thieving morons.

S.F.

Nothing like that EVER happened in paris by the way... Never seen anything like that myself

C.S.

pals dont let us argue we are all celts and we are damn lucky the english are going to take there streets back

S.F.

Well I am sure these people on the streets were all french and pro-EU obviously!

M.W.

Luckily Ken Livingstone is on hand with some well conceived arguments

F.A.

S.F.i really hope i haven't annoyed you. i know this kind of chaos is unprecedented in most western nations in recent times, but all cities do have populations that share characteristics that may be behind this. i'm really sorry if my post earlier suggested anything that could be taken as propaganda. :-S

R.F.

A bunch, Matthew? When a 'bunch' reaches this kid of magnitude, looking for the sociological reasons behind it is sensible, and necessary.

M.W.

I'll give you the reasons behind it - dickheads

R.F.

Exactly, it's the Conservatives' fault XD

M.W.

The thing with dickheads is that they always look to blame someone else.

C.S.

well i started of as looting but now it is getting deliberate organisation

A.P.

Yeah, absolutely right Matthew. Reading this you'd think these were all fine upstanding human beings going through the streets torching peoples property, mugging people.

I'll tell you the reasons for it. Some scum in Tottenham started a riot over a gangster being shot and looting started. They got away with it so more scum from further afield fancied a go because they can and so it snowballs.

A.P.

You Scots shouldnt sound so smug,when you get independence your politicians will go the same way,they will just want power,they will say one thing and do something else..the whole system is rotten to the core..Tory policies are to blame for these riots..they hammer the poor and disadvantaged and this is the result..the incompetence shown by them is inbelievable..would a major company allow all the top bosses to take holidays at the same time..thats what the government allowed

M.W.

‎^ lol

K.L.M.

Poor and disadvantaged? I've just heard a story that an upcoming lawyer was arrested wearing a 'hoodie'. I don't blame the government, perhaps labour should take some responsibility?

H.A.

Perhaps Karen? lol

K.L.M.

Lol. Some wil blame Tories, and some will blame Labour. Either way, riots take place across the world and under many different types of government regimes. I just think some people like to blame whoever suits their agenda.

Alan J B Wyllie

I think this has been building up since 2007ish.

Blaming political parties is puerile.

K.L.M.

I think this gang/thug culture has been around for a good decade now.

We are now like the USA.

L.R.

RIP Broken Britain.. You went soft on discipline!.. You went soft on immigration! Parents were told.. 'No you can't smack the kids'....Teachers were prevented from chastising kids in schools.. The police couldn't clip a troublemaker round the ear.. Kids had rights blah blah blah.. Well done Britain..You shall reap what you sow.. We have lost a whole generation.....thank you!!!!!

M.C.

Almost spot on but nothing to do with immigration, you let yourself down badly on that one

C.S.

scotland wales and ni are not rioting

S.O.

I never normally but I might just have to *lol* at this little collection of cliches.

M.C.

Sooner cliches Scott than burning buildings,destroyed livelihoods and fear

Alan J B Wyllie

Gotta disagree with the OP.

For one, its a tiny minority that is rioting.

Secondly, there has been numerous riots in the UK in the past, this is just the same.

R.H.

sure scott, i guess in your view its because the government closed some youth centers. *LOL* louise your dead right. C.S. scotland wales and ni aren't as broken as england. they still have national identity and national pride; more people there care for their communities.

Mark R.

Louise..you are entitled to your opinion, but personally I think you are a million miles off the truth....

L.R.

Sorry ppl but it's a copy and paste not, not my own words...........

L.R.

It's going around on facebook in other words,,,,

J.B.

I can vouch for that Louise is a general fb thing

S.O.

R.H., you're entitled to any opinion you like, you can get it wrong as often as you like, but I'm entitled to disagree with it. What you're not entitled to do is claim what I think. Particularly when you've got it spectacularly wrong. I don't believe I've once mentioned youth centres (I prefer the English spelling of the word).

J.B.

and some things do have a grain of truth

Mark R.

R.H......perhaps you are right...what an indictment of Tory England then........

K.L.M.

But Mark, what about all those years of Labour?

S.F.‎

“You went soft on immigration"

When I watched the BBC tonight Iheard a few immigrants: a Russian lady owner of a wine bar, an other foreign lady (I could not identify her nationality) owner of a hairdressing salon, both taking about their fear yeterday when being looted; I saw some asian people standing in front of their shops reading to defend themselves...

And I thought that these people were giving such a great example, Britain should be proud to have such a dignified immigration!!

K.L.M.

True, So Fi.

R.H.

Would you buy a gun if you could; given the current situation in the UK? I'm in no fit state to fight thugs. Only way I could defend myself is with a gun. What about your parent / grandparents? Could they defend themselves? The police can't defend us afterall.

K.L.M.

I don't know much about BNP but isn't the right to bear arms a policy of theirs?

R.F.

Oh god don't start talking about guns. Imagine how bad this would be if guns were freely available.

M.W.

Less bad?

K.L.M.

Eeekkkk

M.W.

Gorilla, & would it? You'd have to be a special kind of tool to smash in someone's door knowing there was a pretty good chance that you'd be met with a loaded gun. When the government can't fulfill their number 1 responsibility of protecting citizens & their property would you leave the weak at the mercy of violent thugs or level the playing field?

R.F.

What if the RIOTERS had guns? Who would be stupid enough to sit in their shop with a rifle when a gang of 20-100 armed teenagers is bearing down on them? The smallest of altercations would become lethal almost by default! So far we've avoided loss of life in this, that is a very good thing.

J.B.

No gun law is NOT the answer - what better way to descend into total lawlessness.

Richard Frazer

Don't condone society having guns, but there are potentially 3 more deaths in Birmingham this morning

M.W.

Robin, criminals already do have guns.

M.C. ‎

@ Robin “What if the RIOTERS had guns”

Take it youve not heard the news today then, THREE shor dead in Birmingham, and although it may dissapoint you, the Police didnt do it

R.F.

No I hadn't seen today's news last night, Mick, funnily enough. Are you talking about the three who got run over?? I can't find anything about a shooting anyway. Very sad either way, but I think more guns would mean more deaths whoever's hands they were in.

L.R.

Well, none of you will ever admit that immigration has played a big part because it is forbode on this site to discuss it. Even though I seen on the news there were rioters giving it as a reason, and b'cos they canny get a job! Keep on burying your head in the sand, just like the politicians do.